In this episode, Shannon sits down with Dawni Baxter — founder of a boutique marketing agency and a multi-passionate entrepreneur leading the movement in ethical, human-first marketing. Dawni brings a refreshing perspective to an industry filled with noise, inflated promises, and confusing pricing structures.

Together, Shannon and Dawni dive into:
✨ How to navigate marketing relationships with confidence
✨ Why transparency and trust are the backbone of ethical marketing
✨ What to look for (and avoid) when hiring a marketing agency or contractor
✨ The power of outsourcing — even when it feels uncomfortable
✨ Why real marketing results require time, patience, and accurate data
✨ How fractional marketing directors provide expert support without bloated retainers

Dawni shares why she helped develop the first global regulation for social media managers in the UK, and how her agency champions organic reach and integrity over pushy sales strategies.

This conversation is a must-listen for any entrepreneur — especially solo retreat leaders — who wants to grow sustainably, avoid costly marketing mistakes, and build relationships rooted in alignment and trust.

Key Takeaways

• Ethical marketing is about humans first, not hustle culture.
• Due diligence is essential — marketing professionals are great at marketing themselves.
• Trust your instincts: if a partner feels off, overpriced, or vague, walk away.
• There is no standardized pricing in marketing — and that's exactly why transparency matters.
• Fractional marketing directors are a powerful option for small businesses who need strategy without full-time overhead.
• Outsourcing is uncomfortable — but it's one of the fastest ways to grow as a founder.
• Real marketing results come from consistent data over 12–18 months… not overnight "miracles."
• Quick exits from misaligned relationships often save you more time and money than sticking it out.

Listen to This Episode If You:

• Want to better understand Tantra from a grounded, professional lens.
• Are interested in how men can contribute meaningfully in the retreat space.
• Need inspiration for creating safer, more inclusive, and more profitable retreats.
• Are a retreat leader looking to blend purpose and profit without compromising integrity.

About Dawni Baxter:

Dawn Baxter is a Social Media and selling guru. Multi Business owner including Beyond the Dawn Digital LTD a full house digital marketing brand & agency. Dawn is passionate about helping female entrepreneurs build sustainable brands, community and sales using social media as a connection tool.

A leading UK female entrepreneur in digital business systems and strategy, social media, sales and audience growth. Dawn successfully builds digital business models that increase income, and can be actioned both remotely and around the important things in your life, like children, friends and loved ones.

Dawn has had careers in sales, customer service, buying & merchandising sector and corporate retail within some of the biggest luxury brands in the UK

In 2020 her offers of coaching and training in all areas to service and product based businesses alike helped self employed and SME's to navigate through the Covid Crisis and get their offerings in the digital space. Many made more income than with their previous business model.

She has a passion to support small business and the entrepreneurial spirit and inspire people to try the careers that can make them truly happy. Dawn believes in personal growth and has put herself through numerous trainings in graphic design, digital marketing, Coaching and Positive Psychology to be able to pursue her dreams and is always constantly learning and upscaling. She is warm and inclusive and wants to make the world a pretty place.

Connect with Dawni: www.beyondthedawndigital.com 

The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

• Learn to Host Retreats
• Join our private Facebook Group
• Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
• Get your legal docs for retreats
• Join Shannon in Denver at the Retreat Industry Forum 
• Join our LinkedIn Group
• Apply to be a guest on our show

Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let's create a vibrant retreat community together!

Subscribe:

 Apple Podcast | Google Podcast | Spotify

----------

TIMESTAMPS

Dawni's Background & Ethical Marketing (00:01:20) Dawni shares her multi-passionate journey, agency's human-first approach, and creating the first regulation for social media managers.

Changing Perceptions of Marketing Agencies (00:02:40) Discussion on negative perceptions of marketing, ethical standards, and the agency's quality standard.

Misconceptions About Marketing Agencies (00:04:52) Shannon and Dawni address common fears: high costs, unclear returns, and the importance of organic reach.

Due Diligence & Evaluating Agencies (00:05:51) Dawni explains why skepticism is healthy, how to vet agencies, and the importance of transparency and value.

Pricing Structures & Transparency (00:09:12) Dawni reveals the lack of regulated pricing in marketing and tips for assessing agency pricing and openness.

Value of Exploratory Calls (00:10:11) Advice on seeking agencies that offer value upfront and the significance of exploratory calls.

Retreat Industry Forum Announcement (00:10:46) Shannon promotes the upcoming Retreat Industry Forum event in Denver.

Importance of Marketing Support for Solopreneurs (00:12:17) Shannon emphasizes why solopreneurs need marketing support, either in-house or outsourced.

Fractional Marketing & Flexible Support (00:13:35) Dawni discusses affordable, flexible options like fractional marketing directors and short-term contracts.

Testing Agency Relationships & Learning (00:17:32) Encouragement to try agencies on a trial basis, learn from mismatches, and adapt as needed.

Red Flags & Relationship Building (00:18:28) Shannon shares a negative agency experience and stresses monitoring alignment and communication.

Marketing as Relationship Building (00:19:39) Dawni compares marketing to dating, emphasizing gradual trust-building and the value of expert guidance.

Letting Go & CEO Growth (00:23:08) Dawni describes the transformation when entrepreneurs trust experts, leading to business and personal growth.

Outsourcing Before You're Ready (00:24:18) Advice to outsource marketing a step before feeling ready, without causing financial strain.

Financial Stretch & CEO Space (00:25:25) Shannon shares her experience with hiring help, creating space for CEO-level work, and the need for expert eyes.

Timeframe for Marketing Results (00:27:01) Discussion on realistic expectations for marketing ROI, typically requiring at least six months.

Data, Metrics, and Long-Term Strategy (00:27:25) Dawni explains the importance of data, why viral moments can be misleading, and the need for long-term analysis.

No Quick Fixes in Marketing (00:31:38) Dawni debunks quick-result promises, emphasizing testing, adaptation, and the impossibility of guarantees.

Global Relevance & Dawni's Work (00:32:47) Shannon notes Dawni's agency works worldwide and mentions Dawni's recent photo shoots.

Social Media Content & Travel (00:33:31) Dawni shares about creating social media content in various international locations.

Closing & Farewell (00:34:10) Shannon thanks Dawni, wraps up the episode, and shares where listeners can find more resources.

In this episode, Shannon gets fired up about one of the biggest mistakes retreat leaders make: discounting their retreats.

While a discount might feel like an easy way to fill a few spots, the long-term damage is real - it devalues your experience, trains your audience to wait for price drops, signals desperation, and hurts the entire retreat industry.

Shannon breaks down exactly why discounting is harmful, what it communicates to potential guests, and better alternatives like early-bird bonuses, pay-in-full perks, and smart payment options. She also unpacks the real reason retreat leaders discount - fear - and how to address it in a healthier, business-savvy way.

If you're ready to protect your profit, elevate your positioning, and stop shrinking your worth, this episode is a must-listen.

Key Takeaways

• Retreats are transformational live experiences - not products to be marked down like retail.

• Discounting immediately lowers perceived value and conditions your audience to never pay full price again.

• It signals desperation and damages not just your brand, but the entire retreat industry.

• Live experiences require emotional labor, planning, expertise, and responsibility - none of which should be discounted.

• Instead of discounting, offer early-bird bonuses, pay-in-full perks, and extended payment plans.

• The real reason people discount is fear - not strategy.

• If enrollment is low, you need better messaging, positioning, urgency, and audience warming… not cheaper prices.

   

  The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

  • Learn to Host Retreats
  • Join our private Facebook Group
  • Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
  • Get your legal docs for retreats
  • Join Shannon in Denver at the Retreat Industry Forum 
  • Join our LinkedIn Group
  • Apply to be a guest on our show

   

  Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let's create a vibrant retreat community together!

   

  Subscribe:

   Apple Podcast | Google Podcast | Spotify

---------

TIMESTAMPS

The Problem with Discounting Retreats (00:00:50) Shannon expresses frustration about retreat leaders discounting their retreats and outlines why this is harmful.

Why Discounting Retreats is Harmful (00:01:12) Explains how discounting devalues retreats, signals desperation, and attracts difficult guests.

Negative Impact on Guest Experience and Industry (00:03:42) Discusses how discounting attracts ungrateful guests and lowers perceived value across the retreat industry.

Discounting Hurts Your Margins and Business (00:06:02) Details how discounts cut into profits, making it harder to sustain a retreat business.

Retreats as Premium, Transformational Experiences (00:07:16) Emphasizes that retreats are not products but containers for transformation, requiring significant energy and expertise.

Alternatives to Discounting: Bonuses and Perks (00:08:14) Suggests offering early bird bonuses, pay-in-full perks, and extended payment plans instead of discounts.

Why Retreat Leaders Discount: The Role of Fear (00:10:22) Explores the real reasons behind discounting, such as fear of failure and low signups.

Building Confidence and Enrollment Without Discounts (00:11:30) Encourages improving messaging, marketing, and mindset instead of lowering prices.

Final Advice and Invitation to Community (00:12:39) Urges listeners to stop discounting, value their work, and join the Retreat Industry Forum for support.

Podcast Closing and Resources (00:13:39) Shannon thanks listeners, encourages sharing, and offers free resources for retreat leaders.

In this episode of The Retreat Leaders Podcast, Shannon sits down with Kim DeMoss - Retreat Ranch's Executive Assistant, Yoga Teacher Training host, and long-time retreat collaborator - to talk about what it's really like to experience retreats from both sides: hosting and supporting.

From her early days hosting retreats with Shannon to now managing the logistics behind the scenes, Kim shares candid insights on burnout, boundaries, work-life balance, and how she found her groove in the retreat industry.

They also dive into the digital evolution of the industry - how AI and online visibility are reshaping the way leaders must market their retreats - and why self-awareness is key to finding your place in this ever-changing landscape.

Whether you're leading retreats, supporting them, or figuring out which role fits best, this episode will give you real-world perspective, practical advice, and a reminder that your version of success doesn't have to look like anyone else's.

Key Takeaways

• Retreat leadership has many layers — and not everyone is meant to be front and center.

• Supporting retreats can be just as fulfilling as leading them (and sometimes less stressful).

• Work-life balance matters — especially for women juggling careers, families, and personal growth.

• The retreat industry is evolving fast with AI and digital marketing — adapt or find your unique niche.

• Attracting the right participants is key to creating aligned, transformational retreat experiences.

• Streamlining your focus can lead to more fulfillment and sustainable success.

  Learn about Kim's YTT: https://www.projectmindfulmovement.com/

  The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:
  • Learn to Host Retreats
  • Join our private Facebook Group
  • Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
  • Get your legal docs for retreats
  • Join Shannon in Denver at the Retreat Industry Forum 
  • Join our LinkedIn Group
  • Apply to be a guest on our show
   
  Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let's create a vibrant retreat community together!
   

  Subscribe:

   Apple Podcast | Google Podcast | Spotify

---------

TIMESTAMPS

Kim and Shannon's History (00:00:59) They discuss how they met, their decade-long relationship, and collaborative projects.

Roles in the Retreat Space (00:02:05) Kim shares her experience as both a retreat host and support, and her preference for support roles.

First Retreat at Retreat Ranch (00:03:48) Kim recalls hosting the first retreat at Retreat Ranch and lessons learned from minimal resources.

Balancing Personal Life and Retreat Hosting (00:04:46) Kim explains why she hosts only one retreat a year, citing personal and family circumstances.

Learning from Career Shifts (00:06:05) Shannon relates her own career pivot and how skills transfer to new roles, paralleling Kim's journey.

Letting Go of Expectations (00:07:22) Kim discusses the challenge of disappointing others versus honoring personal capacity and boundaries.

Retreat Industry Forum Announcement (00:08:01) Shannon promotes the upcoming Retreat Industry Forum event in Denver.

Navigating Life Seasons and Work Choices (00:09:06) They talk about making choices that fit current life seasons, especially with family and career changes.

Marketing and Selling Retreats Today (00:10:40) Discussion on how retreat marketing has evolved, becoming more complex and demanding.

Alternative Roles in the Retreat Industry (00:11:51) Exploring ways to stay involved in the industry without hosting, especially if marketing isn't appealing.

Evaluating Retreat Marketing and Audience Fit (00:12:48) Kim reflects on attracting the right participants and lessons from her first retreat's marketing.

Listening to Inner Guidance and Pivoting (00:13:21) They emphasize the importance of listening to intuition and being open to change.

Kim's Strengths and Transition to Support Roles (00:14:24) Kim and Shannon discuss Kim's organizational skills and her move to more supportive, creative roles.

Benefits of Support Roles and Life Transitions (00:16:16) Kim shares the relief and satisfaction of support work during her husband's military retirement transition.

Continued Learning and Growth (00:18:07) They discuss ongoing personal and professional growth, and Kim's involvement in events and trainings.

Differences Between Training and Wellness Retreats (00:18:53) Kim explains how training retreats differ from wellness retreats in focus and participant expectations.

Structuring Training Retreats for Balance (00:20:28) Advice on scheduling downtime in training retreats to avoid burnout for both leaders and attendees.

In this solo episode, Shannon Jamail gets real about something every retreat leader needs to hear: failure isn't the enemy - it's proof that you're in the game.

If you're not failing, you're not trying hard enough. Shannon dives into why "falling short" - whether it's your finances, your workshop, your attendance, or your execution - isn't something to avoid, it's something to learn from.

You can hire the best coach, join the smartest program, and learn from the pros… and you'll still make mistakes. The difference? You'll fail faster and smarter.

Shannon also shares how community is the real secret weapon for success - and how the Retreat Industry Forum is designed to bring that support, connection, and collective wisdom together for retreat hosts ready to grow.

Key Takeaways

• If you're not failing, you're not stretching yourself enough.

• Failure doesn't mean your retreat "flopped" — it means something fell short and gave you data.

• The biggest mistake is waiting on the sidelines instead of doing the thing.

• Coaching and programs can help minimize expensive mistakes, but you'll still fail — that's how you grow.

• Community is what turns failure into forward momentum — and that's exactly what the Retreat Industry Forumis all about.

The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

• Learn to Host Retreats
• Join our private Facebook Group
• Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
• Get your legal docs for retreats
• Join Shannon in Denver at the Retreat Industry Forum 
• Join our LinkedIn Group
• Apply to be a guest on our show

Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let's create a vibrant retreat community together!

Subscribe:

 Apple Podcast | Google Podcast | Spotify

---------

Timestamps

Failure as Evidence of Progress (00:01:09) Explains why failure means you're taking action and is a necessary part of growth in the retreat business.

Defining Failure in Retreats (00:02:10) Clarifies what failure actually looks like in retreats—missed goals, missteps, and learning opportunities.

Personal Failures and Lessons Learned (00:03:17) Shannon shares her own failures and how each one contributed to her growth and resilience.

Taking Action vs. Waiting (00:04:27) Encourages listeners to take action rather than waiting for perfect conditions, emphasizing learning by doing.

The Necessity of Investment (00:05:24) Discusses the importance of investing time, money, and energy into building a sustainable retreat business.

Retreat Industry Forum Promotion (00:06:32) Promotes the upcoming Retreat Industry Forum event, highlighting its value for industry professionals.

Value of Coaching and Courses (00:06:32) Explains how coaching and courses can help avoid mistakes but emphasizes that failure is still part of the process.

Treating Retreats as a Business (00:07:37) Urges listeners to approach retreats professionally, not as a hobby, and to invest in education and growth.

Importance of Community (00:08:40) Highlights the role of community and support in overcoming challenges and learning from others in the industry.

Continuous Learning and Industry Evolution (00:09:45) Stresses the importance of ongoing learning, innovation, and collaboration in the ever-evolving retreat industry.

Encouragement and Call to Action (00:10:53) Encourages listeners to keep moving forward, join the community, and treat their retreat business seriously.

If you're still marketing your retreats like it's 2022, you're already behind.

In this solo episode, Shannon Jamail drops the truth about how the digital marketing landscape has shifted - and why AI integration isn't optional anymore. From Google rewriting your meta descriptions to the rise of algorithmic visibility, the retreat industry is evolving fast.

Shannon breaks down how retreat leaders can start using AI tools strategically - not just for blogs and social media, but to analyze data, personalize messaging, and scale visibility.

She also gives a sneak peek at the Full AI + Marketing Blueprint that she, Erin Haag, and Alison Katschkowsky will unveil at the Retreat Industry Forum in Denver.

Because what worked last year? Isn't what's working now.

Key Takeaways

• AI is changing how every digital platform decides who gets seen.

• Your content needs to speak to humans and machines to stay visible.

• AI isn't here to replace your creativity — it's here to free you to create more connection.

• Marketing that worked a year ago is outdated today.

• You need a plan that evolves as fast as technology — and that's what's coming at the Forum.

 The Retreat Industry Forum — May 14–17, 2026 | Denver, CO
 Learn more at retreatindustryforum.com

The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

• Learn to Host Retreats
• Join our private Facebook Group
• Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
• Get your legal docs for retreats
• Join Shannon in Denver at the Retreat Industry Forum 
• Join our LinkedIn Group
• Apply to be a guest on our show

Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let's create a vibrant retreat community together!

Subscribe:

 Apple Podcast | Google Podcast | Spotify

---------

Timestamps

Introduction & Podcast Overview (00:00:02) Shannon introduces herself, the podcast, and the focus on building profitable, impactful retreat businesses.

Why AI & SEO Matter Now (00:01:16) Explains why traditional marketing is outdated and the necessity of integrating AI and SEO into retreat marketing.

The Shift in Marketing: Context & Authority (00:02:21) Discusses how AI is changing marketing from keywords to context and authority, and the importance of adapting quickly.

AI's Impact on Digital Visibility (00:03:28) Describes how platforms use AI to determine visibility and why digital presence must be optimized for both humans and AI.

Google's AI Meta Descriptions & Forum Promo (00:04:27) Mentions Google testing AI-written meta descriptions and promotes the upcoming Retreat Industry Forum.

Practical Ways to Use AI in Retreat Marketing (00:05:36) Outlines actionable AI strategies: smarter research, automatic content repurposing, performance analysis, and personalized communication.

The Need for Strategic, AI-Optimized Content (00:07:48) Emphasizes that visibility now depends on algorithmic, AI-optimized content, not just posting attractive photos or reels.

In this episode of The Retreat Leaders Podcast, Shannon sits down with Justin Gottlieb - a sexual freedom coach, Tantra practitioner, and retreat host who transitioned from the corporate world to full-time facilitation. Together, they unpack what Tantra really is (and isn't), how to maintain integrity in intimate retreat settings, and why it's time for more men to step into leadership roles in the wellness and retreat space.

Justin shares how he and his co-facilitator Leola create transformational retreats rooted in safety, consent, and empowerment - and how they've built a sustainable retreat business model that honors both healing and profitability.

If you've ever been curious about Tantra, gender balance in leadership, or how to elevate the professionalism of your retreat business, this episode is a must-listen.

Key Takeaways

• Tantra is more than sexuality - it's about energy, presence, and deep personal growth through mindfulness, breathwork, and embodiment.
• Safety and consent are non-negotiable: Justin and Leola's application and interview process ensures aligned participants and safe group dynamics.
• Professionalism matters: Transparent communication with venues and strong operational systems allow facilitators to focus on transformation instead of logistics.
• Masculine–feminine balance: Co-facilitation across genders can create more grounded and powerful retreat experiences.
• Retreats as a real business: Pricing, screening, and intentional marketing are essential to attract committed clients and avoid burnout.

Episode Highlights

[02:15] Justin's transition from corporate life to Tantra and retreat facilitation.
[07:40] Redefining Tantra and clearing misconceptions about Neo-Tantra.
[14:10] How Justin screens participants and ensures emotional safety.
[19:25] The power of venue transparency and building trust with hosts like Retreat Ranch.
[25:50] Why masculine presence is vital in retreat leadership.
[32:00] Pricing, profitability, and shifting the scarcity mindset in the retreat industry.

Listen to This Episode If You:

• Want to better understand Tantra from a grounded, professional lens.
• Are interested in how men can contribute meaningfully in the retreat space.
• Need inspiration for creating safer, more inclusive, and more profitable retreats.
• Are a retreat leader looking to blend purpose and profit without compromising integrity.

Connect with Justin: https://tantralovecoach.com/ 

Instagram: @tantralovecoach

The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

• Learn to Host Retreats
• Join our private Facebook Group
• Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
• Get your legal docs for retreats
• Join Shannon in Denver at the Retreat Industry Forum 
• Join our LinkedIn Group
• Apply to be a guest on our show

Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let's create a vibrant retreat community together!

Subscribe:

 Apple Podcast | Google Podcast | Spotify

--------------------

Timestamps

Justin's Background & Journey to Tantra (00:02:16) Justin shares his transition from corporate to coaching, focusing on intimacy, sexuality, and tantra.

First Retreat Experience & Organization (00:03:48) Discussion of Justin's first retreat, its organization, and Shannon's impressions as a venue owner.

Misconceptions About Tantra (00:04:43) Justin addresses common myths about tantra, clarifying its true focus and practices.

Ideal Retreat Attendees (00:06:42) Justin describes the types of people who attend his retreats and what draws them in.

Screening Process & Boundaries (00:08:23) Justin explains his thorough screening process and the importance of boundaries for safety.

Retreat Industry Forum Announcement (00:10:36) Shannon promotes the upcoming Retreat Industry Forum event in Denver.

Venue Selection & Importance of Safety (00:11:55) Justin discusses what he values in a retreat venue, emphasizing safety, privacy, and support.

Men in the Retreat Industry (00:16:43) Conversation about the underrepresentation of men as retreat leaders and the value of male facilitators.

Profitability & Pricing Mindset (00:19:22) Discussion on treating retreats as a business, pricing strategies, and differences in mindset between men and women.

Screening Through Pricing & Value (00:20:50) Justin explains how pricing acts as a screening tool and why higher investment leads to better outcomes.

Scholarships & Guest Challenges (00:22:41) Both discuss challenges with scholarship attendees and the importance of a strong screening process.

Market Rate & Industry Mindset (00:23:28) Shannon and Justin talk about raising market rates and shifting scarcity mindsets in the industry.

Value Perception & Pricing Story (00:24:23) Justin shares a story illustrating how higher prices increase perceived value and participant commitment.

How to Connect with Justin (00:26:30) Justin provides his contact information and describes his offerings for those interested in working with him.

Episode Wrap-Up & Outro (00:27:25) Shannon thanks Justin, closes the episode, and shares where to find more resources.

In this heartfelt and honest episode of The Retreat Leaders Podcast, Shannon Jamail reconnects with former retreat guest and midlife women's life coach, Remi Gibbs, to talk about everything from freezing yurts to forgiveness-and how retreats offer powerful portals for healing and purpose.

Together, they dive into:

• Remi's unforgettable experience at Retreat Ranch (spoiler: it involves a hot tub and sub-zero temps)
• The difference between acceptance and true forgiveness—and why that distinction matters
• How Shannon handled an unexpected power outage like a pro (a lesson in leadership grace)
• The untapped power of retreats for women navigating midlife, menopause, and major life transitions
• Why healthy habits and hormonal support are non-negotiables for long-term transformation

Whether you're a retreat leader or a woman in the middle of her own life reinvention, this episode is your permission slip to show up real, resilient, and ready to grow.

Learn more: 

Midlife Life Coach + Founder of [Renovated Realities]

https://www.renovatedrealities.com/ 

Instagram: @renovatedrealities

LinkedIn: @remigibbs

The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

• Learn to Host Retreats
• Join our private Facebook Group
• Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
• Get your legal docs for retreats
• Join Shannon in London 
• Join our LinkedIn Group
• Apply to be a guest on our show

Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let's create a vibrant retreat community together!

Subscribe:

 Apple Podcast | Google Podcast | Spotify

----------

Timestamps:

In this uplifting and practical episode of The Retreat Leaders Podcast, Shannon Jamail is joined by UK-based performance coach and former professional dancer Lucy Dutton to talk about something not enough retreat leaders are addressing: how to lead retreats without sacrificing your own well-being.

Lucy shares her powerful journey from the high-stakes world of professional dance to wellness and peak performance coaching—and how her deep understanding of energy, values, and leadership now helps retreat leaders avoid burnout.

Together, they explore:

✅ Why energy management matters more than location or food
✅ The hidden danger of leading retreats while running on empty
✅ How to use your personal values as a decision-making compass
✅ Why your environment directly impacts your energy
✅ The difference between holding space and emotionally oversharing
✅ How to stay inspired and grounded even during high-demand retreats

Whether you're planning your first retreat or you're a seasoned pro, this conversation will help you lead from a place of calm, clarity, and conviction.

About Lucy:

Lucy J Dutton is a certified peak performance coach and speaker , international best selling author with 30 years of experience coaching entrepreneurs on productivity, goal setting, and transforming limiting beliefs. She empowers female holistic service based entrepreneurs and small business owners to become peak performers in life and business.

So that their business grows easily, and they experience fulfilment and joy in their personal life.

Lucy was a professional dancer for 10 years and has been an entrepreneur and coach for over 3 decades. 

Despite the fact that she used to be painfully shy, she found her voice by pushing through the awkward and uncomfortable times. Gradually building her self-confidence and self-belief.

She has founded her own Holistic Peak Performance Coaching business to complement the health coaching she was already doing. With health and fitness being the foundation of everything she does.

Learn more: https://lucyjdutton.com/

The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

• Learn to Host Retreats
• Join our private Facebook Group
• Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
• Get your legal docs for retreats
• Join Shannon in London 
• Join our LinkedIn Group
• Apply to be a guest on our show

Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let's create a vibrant retreat community together!

Subscribe:

 Apple Podcast | Google Podcast | Spotify

-------

Timestamps

Guest Introduction: Lucy Dutton's Background (00:01:43) Lucy shares her journey from professional dancer to peak performance coach.

The Demands of Dancing and Self-Care (00:04:08) Discussion about the physical and emotional demands of dancing and the importance of self-care.

Retreat Leaders' Energy Drain (00:05:35) Shannon describes how retreat leaders often neglect their own well-being, leading to exhaustion.

The Importance of Energy and Daily Practices (00:07:32) Lucy explains the significance of maintaining personal energy and implementing daily self-care practices.

Understanding and Aligning with Core Values (00:09:09) Lucy discusses discovering personal values and how misalignment can affect retreat experiences.

Creating Supportive Environments (00:10:24) Lucy outlines the importance of physical, social, and informational environments for retreat leaders.

Avoiding Negative Influences and Comparison (00:11:55) Shannon emphasizes avoiding negative news, unsupportive people, and comparison with other retreat leaders.

Deep Dive into Values and Retreat Alignment (00:15:50) Lucy explains how knowing your values helps in choosing the right retreat venues and collaborators.

Energy as the Key to Retreat Success (00:19:22) Shannon highlights that a leader's energy can make or break a retreat, outweighing venue or food quality.

How to Work with Lucy Dutton (00:20:14) Lucy shares how listeners can connect with her for coaching and personal development.

Episode Wrap-Up and Resources (00:21:10) Shannon thanks Lucy, mentions additional resources, and closes the episode.

In this heart-filled and high-impact episode of The Retreat Leaders Podcast, Shannon Jamail sits down with luxury couples retreat host Lesley Jordan to explore the real keys to retreat success-and spoiler alert: it's not just about the perfect venue or a pretty website.

From her beginnings as a travel agent to launching powerful, profitable retreats for couples of all backgrounds, Lesley shares how mentorship, strategic pricing, and relationship-first marketing changed the game for her. Together, Shannon and Lesley dig into:

• How to actually pick the right business coach (hint: ask about profit)
• Why building real connections beats flashy marketing
• What it takes to design inclusive retreats that sell out and transform lives
• The truth about vetting mentors in a saturated online space
• Lesley's upcoming LGBTQ+ and heterosexual couples retreats focused on love, intimacy, and reconnection

If you're building a retreat brand that centers around depth, authenticity, and aligned growth—this one's for you.

Learn more: www.lavishcouplesretreats.com 

The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

• Learn to Host Retreats
• Join our private Facebook Group
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Timestamps:

Introducing Leslie Jordan (00:01:00)
Shannon introduces guest Leslie Jordan, highlighting her energy and inviting her to share her background.

Leslie's Journey to Retreats (00:01:35)
Leslie shares her transition from travel agent to retreat curator, focusing on luxury retreats for couples and women.

The Power of Coaching in Retreat Business (00:02:25)
Discussion on meeting through a coach, the importance of having a coach, and the loneliness of entrepreneurship.

Finding the Right Coach (00:03:16)
Leslie describes her experience with different coaches, learning about business models, pricing, and defining her retreat offerings.

Building Relationships Over Pretty Marketing (00:04:00)
Leslie explains the importance of building genuine relationships with clients, not just relying on attractive websites.

Creating Lavish Couples Retreats (00:05:02)
Leslie talks about launching her own retreat business, focusing on reconnection and intimacy for various types of couples.

The Value of Multiple Coaches (00:05:24)
Shannon and Leslie discuss the benefits of having more than one coach with different expertise.

Marketing vs. Selling & Relationship Building (00:06:02)
Emphasis on turning marketing activities into real relationships and the changing landscape of the retreat industry.

Learning Strategy and Pricing (00:06:52)
Leslie shares how her coaches helped her with sales strategies, pricing, and repeat business.

Choosing Experienced Coaches (00:07:29)
Shannon stresses the importance of working with experienced coaches who understand the retreat business deeply.

Treating Retreats as a Business (00:09:00)
Discussion on treating retreats as a business model, not just an event, and integrating it with other offerings.

Overcoming Fear and Stagnation (00:09:18)
Leslie recounts how the wrong coaching held her back and how the right coaches helped her move forward.

Vetting Coaches and Profitability (00:10:36)
Advice on vetting coaches, asking about their experience, and ensuring they understand profitability in retreats.

Industry Trends and Red Flags (00:11:37)
Warning about inexperienced coaches and the importance of understanding all aspects of the retreat business.

Profitability is Essential (00:11:59)
Shannon and Leslie agree that breaking even is not a sustainable business model for retreats.

Attending Retreats as Research (00:12:31)
Leslie shares the value of attending retreats, especially those hosted by your coach, to learn logistics and marketing.

The Importance of Being an Attendee (00:13:11)
Shannon emphasizes that aspiring retreat leaders should attend retreats themselves to gain perspective.

Community and Networking Benefits (00:15:07)
Discussion on the community, networking, and collaborations that come from being part of a coaching group.

Ongoing Value of Retreat Attendance (00:16:24)
Leslie and Shannon discuss the ongoing benefits of attending retreats, including support, networking, and personal growth.

Leslie's Upcoming Retreats (00:17:18)
Leslie shares details about her upcoming retreats for LGBTQ+ and heterosexual couples, and her inclusive approach.

How to Connect with Leslie (00:18:52)
Leslie provides her website and social media handles for listeners to learn more or join her retreats.