BE THAT LAWYER

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Kyle Hebenstreit discuss:

• The evolving legal industry landscape due to institutional capital and Big Four involvement
• Rising competition and channel fragmentation in legal marketing
• Strategic marketing approaches tailored to client personas and firm types
• Operational and budgetary decisions that influence long-term law firm growth

Key Takeaways:

• Private equity and institutional capital are transforming the legal industry, creating new acquisition and exit opportunities for small, consumer-facing law firms.
• Social media platforms like LinkedIn and Meta hold high potential for law firms, yet are underutilized, especially with organic content for referrals and paid campaigns for brand awareness.
• Law firms should begin their marketing strategy by analyzing successful recent clients and understanding how they found them before setting a marketing budget.
• When choosing a marketing partner, inquire about client-to-manager ratios, review actual KPIs, and check references, much like when hiring a full-time employee.

"If you're staying top of mind for your professional network... you can help augment referral traffic that way." —  Kyle Hebenstreit

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!

Thank you to our Sponsor!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Ready to grow your law practice without selling or chasing? Book your free 30-minute strategy session now—let's make this your breakout year: https://fretzin.com/

Episode References: 

The Hard Thing About Hard Things by Ben Horowitz: https://www.amazon.com/Hard-Thing-About-Things-Building/dp/0062273205

About Kyle Hebenstreit: Kyle Hebenstreit is the Chief Executive Officer of PracticeMadePerfect (PMP), where he leads a team dedicated to helping law firms grow through tailored, data-driven marketing solutions. With nearly 20 years of experience across consulting, media, and entrepreneurship, Kyle brings a strategic mindset and a passion for client success. Before joining PMP, he held leadership roles at Deloitte Consulting, Skydance Productions, and served as an Entrepreneur in Residence at NextGen Growth Partners.

Connect with Kyle Hebenstreit:  

Website: http://www.pmpmg.com/

Email: khebenstreit@pmpmg.com

Phone: 3174109640

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/hhebenstreit/

& https://www.linkedin.com/company/pmpmg

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/pmpmg

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pmpmarketinggroup/

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it. 

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Ed Levy discuss:

• Building and nurturing authentic client relationships in professional services
• Increasing referrals through trust and engagement
• The psychological value of personalized client appreciation
• The role of networking and peer communities in growing a legal practice

Key Takeaways:

• Small, personal gestures—like handwritten notes or thoughtful gifts—can leave a lasting emotional impact and increase client loyalty.
• Lawyers who genuinely engage with clients beyond transactions are more likely to receive organic referrals.
• Membership in curated networking groups like Provisors can create structured opportunities to both give and receive high-value referrals.
• Understanding what truly matters to a client—personally and professionally—helps legal professionals build trust and long-term partnerships.

"The most important thing, even with no budget at all, is to separate the business from the appreciation and the emotional connections that you're trying to build." —  Ed Levy

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!

Thank you to our Sponsors!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Ready to grow your law practice without selling or chasing? Book your free 30-minute strategy session now—let's make this your breakout year: https://fretzin.com/

Episode References: 

Got Your Attention? by Sam Horn: https://www.amazon.com/Got-Your-Attention-Intrigue-Connect/dp/1626562504

About Ed Levy: Ed Levy is the owner and president of Edventure Promotions, a company built on two core principles: spend clients’ money as if it were our own and exhaust all possibilities to deliver exceptional results. With over 20 years of experience, Ed has led the company to become a trusted partner to globally recognized brands and organizations of all sizes. He created I Love My PI Lawyer—a groundbreaking program that uses curated gifting experiences to help personal injury lawyers deepen client relationships, increase referrals, and stand out in a competitive market. Ed’s approach emphasizes promotional products as strategic communication tools that drive measurable engagement and campaign success. He remains passionate about helping PI lawyers and professionals elevate their marketing strategies through innovative, results-driven solutions.

Connect with Ed Levy:  

Website: https://www.edventurepromotions.com/ilovemypilawyer

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/edlevy/ & https://www.linkedin.com/company/edventure-promotions/

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it. 

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Alex Geisler discuss:

• Building long-term client loyalty in legal practice
• Structuring legal work around client expectations and needs
• Improving legal service delivery through lean process thinking
• Developing deeper relationships through proactive, strategic communication

Key Takeaways:

• Long-term client loyalty is built through the TREE approach: Transparency in communication, Reliability in service, Efficiency in delivery, and clear Expectations that align with the client's goals.
• Lawyers can create stronger, “stickier” client relationships by going beyond transactional work and offering value through strategic thinking and curiosity.
• A structured approach to legal work—planning, executing, reviewing, and improving—can lead to better results, stronger client trust, and greater efficiency.
• Understanding the client’s definition of success early on, and tailoring the legal approach accordingly, is key to exceeding expectations and retaining business.

"There's no substitute for knowing yourself and knowing your purpose. There's no substitute for knowing your client. And just keep checking in on yourself and checking in on your client." —  Alex Geisler

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!

Thank you to our Sponsors!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Ready to grow your law practice without selling or chasing? Book your free 30-minute strategy session now—let's make this your breakout year: https://fretzin.com/

Episode References: 

Tao Te Ching by Lao Tzu: https://terebess.hu/english/tao/mitchell.html

About Alex Geisler: Alex's career was spent in three environments: in-house, at Big Law, and with manufacturers. He then harnessed these experiences to create Lean Law, a consultancy devoted to helping lawyers turn new business into repeat business. In addition to personal coaching, his ideas can be accessed through the acclaimed Lean Adviser online curriculum, his Lean Briefing—which receives 40,000 hits each week—and his books and papers.

Connect with Alex Geisler:  

Website: https://www.leanlaw.co/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alex-geisler-05b5761a/

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions.

 You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it. 

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Judy Barton discuss:

• Cultivating meaningful and lasting business relationships
• Effective networking techniques for lawyers and financial professionals
• Establishing credibility and attracting opportunities
• The importance of integrity in business

Key Takeaways:

• Effective networking is not about collecting contacts but about fostering genuine, mutually beneficial relationships that lead to long-term success.
• Lawyers and financial professionals should focus on providing value first, rather than immediately seeking business, to build trust and credibility.
• Personal branding plays a crucial role in professional growth, as a strong and authentic presence can differentiate individuals in competitive industries.
• Integrity and consistency in business interactions build a solid reputation, making people more likely to refer and work with you over time.

"You have to make yourself memorable, but you also have to know why you're different from everybody else and why that person should hire you or engage with you as an attorney." —  Judy Barton

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!

Thank you to our Sponsors!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Each week, Raise the Bar delivers expert insights on business development, legal tech, and the strategies top rainmakers lawyers use to build thriving practices. No fluff—just actionable tips to help you work smarter and grow faster. Subscribe for free at RaiseTheBarMedia.co: https://content.raisethebarmedia.co/raise-the-bar-newsletter-sign-up/?cid=679b5ad89eeed

About Judy Barton: Judy Barton is a Senior Client Strategist for BNY Mellon Wealth Management. In this role, she works directly with clients to address their investment and wealth management needs. Judy joined the firm in 2014 and has more than 20 years of experience in the financial services industry, as well as being a business owner for 10 years. Her previous corporate experience includes serving in finance at EDS, Nortel, and Sodexho Marriott in Boston, DC, and London. Judy received her Master in Legal Studies from the School of Law at Washington University in St. Louis and a Bachelor of Science in Finance from the University of Oklahoma.

Connect with Judy Barton: 

Website: http://www.bny.com/wealth

Email: judy.barton@bny.com

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/judy-barton

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it. 

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Michael Vater discuss:

• Growth and networking beyond traditional legal marketing
• Leveraging legal tech and AI to enhance efficiency
• Building strategic partnerships for sustainable growth
• Effectively balancing leadership, operations, and legal work

Key Takeaways:

• Lawyers should build strategic partnerships with realtors, title agents, and medical professionals who connect with potential clients needing legal services instead of relying solely on attorney referrals.
• Generative AI tools enhance legal research by cross-referencing case law and statutes, helping attorneys find crucial precedents faster and more accurately.
• Zoom court appearances reduce travel time and create "bonus time" for attorneys to focus on business development and client acquisition.
• Law firms often let accounts receivable grow unchecked, but strict payment policies like upfront retainers or automated billing prevent financial strain and ensure cash flow.

"The world is constantly changing. If you fail to change with it, you will be left behind." —  Michael Vater

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!

Thank you to our Sponsors!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Each week, Raise the Bar delivers expert insights on business development, legal tech, and the strategies top rainmakers lawyers use to build thriving practices. No fluff—just actionable tips to help you work smarter and grow faster. Subscribe for free at RaiseTheBarMedia.co: https://content.raisethebarmedia.co/raise-the-bar-newsletter-sign-up/?cid=679b5ad89eeed

Episode References: 

The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People by Stephen Covey: https://www.amazon.com/Habits-Highly-Effective-People-Powerful/dp/0743269519

About Michael Vater: Michael Vater, Esq., Managing Partner of The Ticktin Law Group in South Florida, has successfully litigated complex cases across the U.S. and abroad, including over 20 Florida counties, California, Texas, Pennsylvania, Ohio, South Carolina, and Iceland, where his victory set a European Union precedent on consumer rights in aviation disputes. Since joining the firm in 2010, he has specialized in entertainment, personal injury, and real estate litigation, serving as lead counsel in over 1,600 cases and litigating 100+ Jury and Non-Jury Trials. Recognized by Super Lawyers as a Rising Star, awarded to only 2.5% of Florida lawyers, he has also been featured in Authority Magazine, Lawyers of Distinction, Business Daily Media, and PacerMonitor.

Connect with Michael Vater:  

Website: https://legalbrains.com/

Email: mvater@legalbrains.com

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-ticktin-law-group-p.a./

Twitter: https://x.com/LegalBrains

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TheTicktinLawGroup/#

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/legalbrains/#
 

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it. 

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Tom Ciesielka discuss:

• The role of public relations and reputation management in the legal industry
• The importance of media visibility and thought leadership for lawyers
• Balancing legal ethics, confidentiality, and public exposure in marketing
• The impact of social media on modern public relations strategies

Key Takeaways:

• Media outlets prioritize availability and recognition over legal expertise—being well-known and responsive is often more important than having the best case results.
• Lawyers should integrate the PESO model (Paid, Earned, Shared, and Owned media) into their marketing strategy to create a balanced and effective public presence.
• Addressing negative media coverage should be handled with a focus on advocacy, emphasizing key legal issues and potential next steps rather than becoming defensive.
• Thought leadership and PR require a long-term commitment—lawyers should expect a minimum six-month investment before seeing meaningful results in recognition and business growth.

"Your first obligation is to your client, not to publicizing your firm. That’s just the reality of it." —  Tom Ciesielka

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!

Thank you to our Sponsors!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Rainmakers Roundtable: https://www.fretzin.com/lawyer-coaching-and-training/peer-advisory-groups/

Episode References: 

LawHer Podcast by Sonya Palmer: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/lawher/id1599413853

Personal Injury Mastermind Conference (PIMCON), October 5–8, 2025 in Scottsdale, Arizona: https://www.pimcon.org/

The 1-Page Marketing Plan by Allan Dib: https://www.amazon.com/1-Page-Marketing-Plan-Customers-Money/dp/1989025013/

About Tom Ciesielka: Tom Ciesielka, President of TC Public Relations, has over 25 years of experience in public relations, marketing, and business development. He helps clients manage their reputation through crisis communications, thought leadership, and media coverage in outlets like The Wall Street Journal, CNN, NPR, and Fox News. Before founding TC Public Relations, he worked in film sales—representing Paramount, MGM, and New Line Cinema—and as marketing director for the Museum of Broadcast Communications. Originally from Philadelphia, he built his firm in Chicago on integrity, strategy, and innovation. Now in its third decade, TC Public Relations continues to refine media strategies that elevate client visibility.

Connect with Tom Ciesielka:  

Website: https://tcpr.net/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thomasciesielka/

Twitter: https://x.com/Tomciesielka

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/tcpublicrelations/

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it. 

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Jim Ries discuss:

• Why business development is a critical yet often overlooked skill for lawyers
• The role of networking in long-term professional success
• How adopting a giver’s mentality leads to stronger professional relationships
• Best practices and common mistakes in networking and relationship-building

Key Takeaways:

• Taking a few minutes to research a common connection before meetings and using the "FORD Method" (Family, Occupation, Recreation, Dreams) leads to more engaging and productive networking conversations.
• Effective networking is about quality over quantity, so instead of collecting business cards, aim for three meaningful conversations that lead to valuable follow-ups.
• Trust is built through consistent action, so always follow through on promises like introductions or shared resources to strengthen credibility and relationships.
• Business development requires patience and persistence, as long-term success comes from continuously nurturing relationships and staying top-of-mind for future opportunities.

"The phrase I like to use is not "give to get"—that sounds like expecting something in return. The phrase I use is "give to give"—give because you want to… because it feels good… and just keep giving. That’s when people know you, like you, and trust you." —  Jim Ries
 

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!

Thank you to our Sponsors!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Rainmakers Roundtable: https://www.fretzin.com/lawyer-coaching-and-training/peer-advisory-groups/

Episode References: 

The Go-Giver by Bob Burg and John David Mann: https://www.amazon.com/Go-Giver-Expanded-Little-Powerful-Business/dp/1591848288

The Little Red Book of Selling by Jeffrey Gitomer: https://www.amazon.com/Little-Red-Book-Selling-Principles/dp/1885167601

The Sales Bible by Jeffrey Gitomer: https://www.amazon.com/Sales-Bible-Ultimate-Resource-Jeffrey/dp/B00DEK8F8M

About Jim Ries: Jim Ries, Director of Business Development at Offit Kurman, connects business owners with the right attorneys across 30+ practice areas. Known as the "Legal BD Guy," he ensures clients aren’t underserved, overcharged, or ignored. As a trusted legal concierge, he helps business owners frustrated with their current representation. A passionate networker, Jim loves one-on-one Zoom meetings to build connections and provide legal solutions.

Connect with Jim Ries: 

Website: http://www.offitkurman.com/

Email: jries@offitkurman.com

Phone: 410-733-6133

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jimrieslegalbdguy/ & https://www.linkedin.com/company/offit-kurman/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jim.ries

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it. 

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and David Ackert discuss:

• The importance of strategic networking
• Leveraging existing contacts for business growth
• The role of influence and prioritization in business development
• The psychology behind relationship building

Key Takeaways:

• Attendees should prioritize learning about others, finding strategic partners, and providing value instead of aggressively selling, as networking is about relationships, not transactions.
• Rather than amassing connections, professionals should build a “shortlist” of key clients, dormant contacts, and high-value prospects for deeper, more meaningful engagement.
• Research shows it takes about 14 interactions from first contact to first contract, so business developers must stay consistent and strategic instead of giving up early.
• The best strategic partners should be assessed on chemistry (rapport), commerce potential (key contacts), capabilities (competence), and collaboration (willingness to reciprocate).

"What we found is that it generally takes our successful users about 14 interactions between first contact and first contract." —  David Ackert

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!

Thank you to our Sponsors!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Rainmakers Roundtable: https://www.fretzin.com/lawyer-coaching-and-training/peer-advisory-groups/

Episode References: 

Smart Collaboration by Heidi K. Gardner: https://www.amazon.com/Smart-Collaboration-Professionals-Succeed-Breaking/dp/1633691101

About David Ackert: David is the Co-Founder and CEO of Ackert, Inc. and PipelinePlus and a respected business development thought leader. For over two decades, he has pioneered revenue acceleration programs for professional services firms and founded ventures like Legal Lift, the MLR100, and PipelinePlus. His award-winning programs and software have been featured in NLJ’s Technologies on the Rise. A sought-after speaker, he keynotes partner retreats, industry conferences, and lectures at USC, Carnegie Mellon, and UCLA School of Law. He is also the author of The Short List and a contributor to The Wall Street Journal, Above the Law, and Law.com.

Connect with David Ackert:  

Website: http://www.pipelineplus.com/

Email: david@pipelineplus.com

Book: The Short List by David Ackert: https://www.amazon.com/Short-List-Business-Development-Focusing/dp/B0DCQ2Q8MS

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidackert/

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it. 

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Kyle Harbaugh discuss:

• Challenges in law firm business operations
• The importance of business strategy in law firms
• Hiring and leadership in law firms
• Leveraging AI and technology for growth

Key Takeaways:

• Many attorneys excel in legal practice but struggle with business management because law school does not prepare them for running a firm, resulting in inefficiencies and unnecessary stress.
• Most law firms lack a clearly defined and well-communicated vision, leading to misalignment within their teams and making it harder to attract and retain the right talent.
• Hiring mistakes often stem from relying too much on gut instinct instead of structured assessments and long-term goal alignment, which leads to high turnover and poor culture fit.
• AI-driven tools can help law firms make smarter business decisions by identifying growth opportunities and ensuring new hires align with the firm’s culture and objectives.

"Just because they are very successful in one role, it doesn’t mean they’re going to be successful when you elevate them." —  Kyle Harbaugh
 

Got a challenge growing your law practice? Email me at steve@fretzin.com with your toughest question, and I'll answer it live on the show—anonymously, just using your first name!
 

Thank you to our Sponsors!

Rankings.io: https://rankings.io/

Rainmakers Roundtable: https://www.fretzin.com/lawyer-coaching-and-training/peer-advisory-groups/
 

Episode References: 

The Game with Alex Hormozi: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-game-with-alex-hormozi/id1254720112

$100M Offers by Alex Hormozi: https://www.amazon.com/100M-Offers-People-Stupid-Saying/dp/1737475731
 

About Kyle Harbaugh: Kyle Harbaugh is the co-founder of Chief GO Officers, LLC, a business consulting firm specializing in law firm growth, operations, and organizational development. With 14+ years of experience, he focuses on management, business planning, and coaching to help firms scale while improving efficiency and client satisfaction. His approach integrates business intelligence, automation, and AI tools like STEP Ai and Right Hire Ai. Offering group and 1:1 coaching, fractional implementation, and strategic growth systems, Kyle helps law firms optimize profitability, branding, and client acquisition for predictable revenue and leadership excellence.
 

Connect with Kyle Harbaugh:  

Website: https://www.chiefgoofficers.com/

Email: KyleH@ChiefGoOfficers.com

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kyle-harbaugh-chief-go-officers/ & https://www.linkedin.com/company/chief-go-officers-llc

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn't Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Audio production by  Turnkey Podcast Productions. You're the expert. Your podcast will prove it.