The Product Experience

Transformations are hard, and too often, they fail to deliver on their promise. In this episode of The Product Experience, Lily and Randy speak with Jen Swanson, CEO of Tuckpoint Advisory Group, to unpack why transformation initiatives falter and what it truly takes to succeed.

Key Takeaways
— Transformation requires intentionality: Real transformation isn't accidental or surface-level; it must be deliberate, comprehensive, and backed by leadership.
— Avoid ‘transformation theatre’: Pretending to change—without restructuring ownership, processes, or collaboration—is worse than doing nothing at all.
— Start with honest orientation: Knowing your starting point is essential before plotting a path forward.
— Executive involvement is non-negotiable: Transformations can’t be delegated. Leadership must model the change and communicate relentlessly.
— Product-led is about mindset, not just teams: Everyone should operate within the product model, but not all need to be on product teams.
— Pace matters: Organisations must assess their capacity for change and determine the right balance between ambition and sustainability.
— Give grace for the learning curve: People need space to be bad at new things before they get good—psychological safety is essential.

Chapters
0:00 – Introduction & the myth of sneaky transformations
1:01 – Jen’s background and path into product
2:53 – What transformation really means
5:53 – Defining honest orientation
8:00 – What is transformation theatre?
12:09 – When real change feels fake
13:04 – The importance of executive commitment
16:04 – Why transformations fail
19:11 – Common catalysts for transformation
22:06 – Product-led vs product thinking
25:00 – Who’s in the op

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.

What does it mean to build world-class products in the age of AI? In this episode, Randy Silver talks to Ezinne and Oji Udezue, co-authors of Building Rocketships, a playbook for building high-growth companies in today’s fast-evolving tech landscape. Together, they unpack what product looks like now, how AI changes collaboration, and why ambition, clarity, and disciplined execution matter more than ever.

Key takeaways
— Building world-class products starts with clear ambition and choosing big, meaningful problems
— AI isn't replacing PMs, it's changing the way product work gets done—especially in how we collaborate
— Vibe coding enables faster iteration and clearer communication through prototyping in code
— The product manager’s job is to lead teams and help the organisation build the right thing, not just anything
— Clarity, focus, and leadership buy-in are essential to successful transformation, even in legacy organisations
— Product teams need to shift from writing specs to orchestrating systems that drive customer and business outcomes
— Every product person should master the full arc: solving today's problems, helping customers succeed, and spotting future opportunities

Chapters 
0:00 The "should PMs code?" debate
1:54 First product roles and how the book came to life
4:49 The mission behind Building Rocketships
7:13 Why the book is for leaders and their partners
10:01 Differences between world-class teams and everyone else
13:35 What ambition really looks like
17:10 How clarity transforms legacy companies
23:10 AI, vibe coding, and the new spec: working prototypes
30:10 Redefining the product team’s role in the AI age
35:02 What skills PMs actually need to thrive now
42:54 The one mistake PMs can't afford to make

Featured Links: Follow Ezinne on LinkedIn | Follow Oji on LinkedIn | ProductMind | Buy their new book 'Building Rocketships: Product Management for High Growth Companies'

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.

This week on The Product Experience, we revisit a great conversation with Todd Green, now President of King – the studio behind Candy Crush. Todd shares how he thinks about building products that are not only globally successful but enduringly fun. 

Todd takes us behind the curtain on what it really takes to build for mass audiences, create fun at scale, and grow empowered product teams.

Key takeaways

• Fun can’t be optimised: Building successful games (or products) requires capturing something visceral. Metrics help, but “fun” starts as a feeling, not a number.
• Audience motivation matters more than demographics: Instead of targeting by age or gender, King focuses on why people play – whether it’s for calm, connection or challenge.
• Legacy products need product management too: The real work starts when a product survives beyond launch. King invests heavily in balancing new features with legacy complexity.
• Good product leaders own the business: At King, product leads (executive producers) are responsible for P&L – it's a full-stack role across delivery, team, and outcomes.
• Sharing insights is a team sport: King has full-time roles and informal networks dedicated to transferring learning between game teams.
• Ethical responsibility is core: King prioritises player wellbeing and long-term satisfaction – not just engagement – as a business principle.
• Building great managers is a product in itself: Todd sees first-line manager development as one of his top priorities for sustaining culture and performance.

Key chapters 

•  00:00 – Intro and Todd’s promotion
•  01:40 – Todd’s media roots and time at Fremantle
•  06:15 – Digital bibles and global format sharing
•  10:50 – Lessons from the Susan Boyle YouTube moment
•  13:40 – Shifting to King and the discovery of fun
•  18:30 – Motivations beyond boredom
•  22:45 – Building for a massive, diverse audience
•  26:40 – The product structure at King
•  30:10 – Keeping Candy Crush fresh after years at the top
•  35:05 – When to launch a new game
•  38:50 – Ethics and responsibility in game design
•  42:20 – Why qual and quant both matter
•  45:10 – How King shares knowledge across teams
•  48:00 – The hiring landscape and talent challenges
•  51:00 – Growing new managers and inclusive leadership
•  54:10 – Closing thoughts and Todd’s reflections

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.

AI has changed the way developers work—and Stack Overflow is right at the centre of that shift. In this episode, Jody Bailey, CPTO at Stack Overflow, shares how the platform is adapting to AI, protecting its community, and embracing new revenue streams. We explore how LLMs are reshaping developer behaviour, why canonical answers still matter, and what it takes to keep trust, quality and community alive in the age of instant AI-generated code. If you’re working on dev tools, building with AI, or just wondering how to keep your product relevant through disruption, this one’s for you.

Key takeaways

• AI is both a disruptor and an enabler
• Engagement is shifting, not disappearing
• Community remains the core asset
• AI doesn't kill quality—it challenges it
• Prompt engineering is the new entry-level skill
• Innovation is iterative—even with AI
• Stack is designing for tomorrow’s engineers
• Jody’s vision is long term

Chapters
00:00 – intro to Jody Bailey and his role at Stack Overflow
03:30 – impact of AI and shift in how developers search for answers
07:45 – Stack’s new business model: licensing data to LLMs
10:15 – protecting community-contributed data and enforcing attribution
13:20 – changing nature of search and the role of AI
17:00 – trust, verification, and the evolving user experience
21:10 – internal AI experiments and lessons learned
25:00 – balancing community, learning, and AI-powered answers
28:20 – new skills required for developers in an AI world
31:40 – evolving engineering roles and the future of team structures
36:10 – making Stack Overflow accessible for the next generation
39:50 – what Jody’s most excited about for the future

Featured Links: Follow Jody on LinkedIn | Stack Overflow | ‘Yes, Artificial Intelligence Has A Creative Side, Sort Of’ feature at Forbes

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.

Intercom’s CPO Paul Adams joins The Product Experience to talk about how the company has radically transformed its approach in the wake of AI's acceleration. From ripping up roadmaps and reorganising teams to reinventing pricing models, Paul shares what it really takes to adapt—fast.

Key takeaways

• "You’re not selling users anymore. You’re selling work."
• AI has shifted Intercom’s business model from seat-based to outcome-based pricing—charging per resolution, not per person.
• "We ripped up our strategy five days after ChatGPT launched."
• Intercom made a bold, immediate pivot to reorient its product and vision around AI, including launching a new website and scrapping existing roadmaps.
• "The only thing that’s persisted is our principles."
• While teams, triads and structures were dismantled, Intercom kept its core product principles intact—like 'start with the problem'.
• "This isn’t evolution—it’s a new species of company."
• Intercom now compares itself to AI-native startups, not its former self. It has rebuilt the product team into flexible, role-fluid workstreams.
• "People have left because it’s not for them."
• The pace of change has human costs. Leadership must communicate directly and honestly to support people through radical transformation.
• "I worry I’ll be left behind too."
• Even senior leaders are actively relearning—Paul admits to using tools like Replit and Lovable to stay current with AI-native UX trends.

Chapters

• 00:00 – Opening thoughts: fear of being left behind in the AI era
• 00:18 – Introduction to the episode and Paul Adams
• 01:00 – Paul’s journey from Google and Facebook to Intercom
• 01:51 – What it’s like to witness Intercom evolve over 11+ years
• 02:22 – The energy and disruption brought on by AI
• 03:17 – From seat-based to value-based pricing: the big shift
• 05:06 – Why AI made Intercom rethink everything, fast
• 07:58 – Sales team challenges: retraining to sell a new model
• 09:43 – The business impact: Fin’s rapid growth and dual-model tension
• 11:02 – What it means to “sell work” instead of licences
• 12:58 – New kinds of jobs emerging around AI tooling
• 14:45 – Ripping up process: how Intercom builds products now
• 16:00 – Competing with AI-native startups, not legacy Intercom
• 17:49 – The one thing that stayed: Intercom’s product principles
• 18:54 – Why starting with the probl

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.

In this episode of The Product Experience podcast, we sit down with Product Consultant Joca Torres, whose work at Gympass is featured in Marty Cagan’s book Transformed. Joca shares the four core principles of successful digital transformation—principles he’s applied in both high-growth startups and century-old corporations.

We unpack what it really takes to shift a company from a delivery mindset to a product-led culture, the traps of discovery theatre, and how empowered teams actually behave. 

Key takeaways
— Discovery should be fast and focused. Avoid drawn-out discovery phases that confirm what you already know. Good discovery is grounded in existing insights and validated quickly.
— The Four Principles of Product Culture:

• Deliver Early and Often – Frequent releases drive learning and responsiveness.
• Focus on the Problem – Avoid premature solutions. Spend time understanding what really needs solving.
• Deliver Results – Products are a means, not an end. Success is measured in impact, not output.
• Ecosystem Mindset – Recognise the full range of users and stakeholders. Product is about balancing value across them.

— Transformation is behavioural, not technical. Digital tools are important, but they won’t matter if people and processes don’t change with them.
— Executive sponsorship is essential. Cultural shifts only take hold when the leadership team actively supports and models them.
— Beware of product theatre. Following the right rituals doesn’t mean you’re creating value. Focus on outcomes, not optics.
— Empowered teams are responsible teams. True empowerment means owning the problem, the solution, and the results. It isn’t for everyone.

Chapters
00:00 – The Problem with “Discovery”
01:00 – Introducing Joca Torres
02:30 – A Surprising Need for Digital Transformation
04:00 – What Makes a True Digital Transformation
08:00 – The Four Pillars of Change
13:00 – Thinking Beyond the End User
17:00 – From Feature Delivery to Outcome Ownership

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.

As startups grow, product teams often find themselves caught between speed and structure. In this episode of The Product Experience, Charlotte King, Lead Product Manager at eBay, shares practical insights from her work leading teams through this transition at companies including Moonpig, Flipdish, and ThoughtWorks. 

Charlotte unpacks how to define product’s role during scaleup, build team structure around strategic value, and use tools like Wardley Mapping and Team Topologies to support organisational change. She also introduces the DHM model (Delightful, Hard to copy, Margin-enhancing) and discusses how to make strategy tangible for cross-functional teams. This conversation is especially useful for product leaders, heads of product, and founders navigating scale.

Chapters
1:13 – Charlotte’s background
2:36 – Product’s role in startups, scaleups and enterprises
4:35 – What product teams need to succeed during scale
6:42 – Defining product’s role as the company grows
9:00 – Using Wardley Mapping to assess team maturity
14:30 – Creating and communicating guiding principles
20:30 – Using the DHM model to prioritise value
25:48 – Structuring teams with Team Topologies
29:03 – Multidisciplinary collaboration in practice
30:41 – Lessons from leading transformation
32:30 – Final reflections and takeaways

Featured Links: Follow Charlotte on LinkedIn | eBay | Wardley Maps | What we learned at #mtpcon London 2025' feature by Kent McDonald and Louron Pratt

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.

In this episode on The Product Experience, we welcome back Matt LeMay—author, consultant, and champion of no-nonsense product thinking. We dig deep into the ideas behind his new book Impact First Product Teams and explore how teams can focus on what really matters: delivering business impact.

Featured Links: Follow Matt on LinkedIn and his website | Buy Matt's new book 'Impact-first Product Teams' | Sudden Compass | Randeep Sidhu's episode on The Product Experience: 'Lessons from building the UK's test and trace app'

Chapters
00:00 – The Myth of Rational Business
01:03 – Matt’s Accidental Journey into Product
02:20 – What Are “Impact-First” Teams, Really?
04:50 – Why OKRs Are Often Just Theatre
07:12 – Best Practices ≠ Business Value
10:00 – Who’s on the Product Team, and Why It Matters
12:30 – Dealing With Cross-Team Goal Conflicts
15:00 – Culture Change via Strategic Goal Alignment
17:00 – Proactive Conversations About Impact
20:00 – Commercial Awareness for Product Teams
24:00 – Platform Teams & Measuring Amplified Impact
27:00 – What Do Good Impact-First Teams Look Like?
31:00 – Customer-Centricity vs. Business Impact
34:00 – Discovery, Metrics & Mission-Critical Goals
36:00 – Culture, Strategy & Individual Leverage
41:00 – BAU vs. Innovation: Set Clear Expectations
44:00 – The Ego Trap in Product Work
46:00 – Matt’s Final Zinger on Capital and Feelings

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.

Sunsetting features is rarely a celebrated milestone in product, but it’s often one of the most critical. In this episode, Ronie Ben Aharon CPO and CTO of Craft.io, joins Lily and Randy to share how his team made the tough call to retire a key feature—and what they learned in the process.

Ronie walks us through a real-world example of removing Craft.io’s visual spec tool, why trying to compete with established platforms like Figma didn’t make sense, and how they approached the transition with both technical rigour and user empathy. He also explains what happens when a sunset strategy goes wrong, and the lingering costs of keeping legacy features alive.

Key takeaways
- Sunsetting is about creating space for more impactful product work.
- Features that seem harmless because they’re underused often introduce hidden costs, especially when they complicate onboarding, UX, and development cycles.
- Data-related features are the hardest to retire. Plan for thoughtful migration and clear communication with users.
- Soft approaches, like “feature starvation,” can backfire and prolong technical debt.
- Strong collaboration between product, customer success, and engineering is key to pulling off a successful sunset.

Chapters
0:00 – Why announcing a feature sunset is rarely met with applause
1:58 – What makes sunsetting necessary, and why underused features are a risk
5:01 – How to recognise when it’s time to kill a feature
6:10 – The story behind Craft.io’s visual spec feature and why they let it go
9:01 – Navigating the difficult conversations with users who still rely on a dying feature
12:27 – Handling data migration without compromising user trust
14:04 – A sunset that didn’t go as planned: learning from the feedback portal misstep
22:44 – Managing engineering expectations and avoiding unnecessary rebuilds
24:38 – How sunsetting shapes the way new features are designed
26:11 – Final reflections on doing it right—and why it’s worth it

Featured Link: Follow Roni on LinkedIn | Craft.io | Figma | 'Sunsetting success: How to strategically phase out products in the digital age' feature by Balaji Ananthanpilla and Sabah Qazi at Mind The Product

Our Hosts
Lily Smith enjoys working as a consultant product manager with early-stage and growing startups and as a mentor to other product managers. She’s currently Chief Product Officer at BBC Maestro, and has spent 13 years in the tech industry working with startups in the SaaS and mobile space. She’s worked on a diverse range of products – leading the product teams through discovery, prototyping, testing and delivery. Lily also founded ProductTank Bristol and runs ProductCamp in Bristol and Bath.

Randy Silver is a Leadership & Product Coach and Consultant. He gets teams unstuck, helping you to supercharge your results. Randy's held interim CPO and Leadership roles at scale-ups and SMEs, advised start-ups, and been Head of Product at HSBC and Sainsbury’s. He participated in Silicon Valley Product Group’s Coaching the Coaches forum, and speaks frequently at conferences and events. You can join one of communities he runs for CPOs (CPO Circles), Product Managers (Product In the {A}ether) and Product Coaches. He’s the author of What Do We Do Now? A Product Manager’s Guide to Strategy in the Time of COVID-19. A recovering music journalist and editor, Randy also launched Amazon’s music stores in the US & UK.