The Unburdened Leader

Leadership

The Unburdened Leader podcast, hosted by Rebecca Ching, LMFT.

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Latest Episodes

EP 115: Permission to Speak: Reclaiming Your Voice Beyond Relational Trauma with Samara Bay

What prevents you from speaking up?

When you were younger, what was your experience when you spoke up? Were you heard, or were you silenced, ignored, or punished?

The echoes of earlier wounds often shape our ability to speak up. Our ability to speak up is often influenced by the burden of past experiences, whether it's in meetings, public forums, or one-on-one conversations, speaking up can feel like a significant risk when past relational traumas resurface.

Even the most confident leaders may carry fears of rejection, judgment, or failure, stemming from previous experiences of not being heard or valued. We may worry about being misunderstood or feel that our words lack significance.

Embracing your voice, even in the face of uncertainty, is a transformative act. It's a journey towards building more courage and leading in alignment with your values.

Speaking with grounded confidence isn't just about exerting authority; it's about fostering trust, connection, and respect within yourself and with those you lead.

Today’s guest lives the principles she teaches on speaking up and showing up with more power, especially for those who hold identities outside of dominant cultural norms. Her work offers us all a powerful road map for speaking up without exiling our story.

Samara Bay is the author of the best-selling book, Permission to Speak, a revolutionary take on public speaking for the future we want. She is a Los Angeles-based speech coach whose clients range from candidates for US Congress to C-suite executives, change-making entrepreneurs, movie stars, and high school girls. She has led workshops and keynotes for groups across various industries, from significant corporations to nonprofit foundations and academic institutions, and her work has been widely featured in the media.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

How Samara’s work with emerging political leaders caused her to realize that we need to change the narrative of how authority is “supposed” to sound
How she connects losing her voice in grad school to an internalized shame of sounding “different” that people of non-dominant identities carry
Why we need to shift the narrative to allow authoritative voices to be emotionally honest and vulnerable
The value of using our voices to care out loud and to tell our stories
Why it’s normal to sound different in various settings, as long as we aren’t compromising our integrity
Unpacking common “negative” speech patterns and how they function in our communication
Breaking down the impossible balancing acts of archetypes we expect of women in power

Learn more about Samara Bay:

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

EP 114: Why Bother? Navigating Burnout and Rediscovering Purpose with Jennifer Louden

When was the last time you said, “Why bother?”

When overwhelm, exhaustion, burnout, and the weight of responsibility set in, it's easy to become cynical and ask, "What's the point?"

Cynicism can be a defense mechanism, shielding us from difficult emotions or experiences, but it also traps us in survival mode, limiting our ability to see new possibilities or paths forward.

Constantly being in fight-or-flight mode makes it difficult to think long-term and to rest and reset as needed.

Today, we're exploring what, "Why bother?" really indicates for leaders. It serves as a sign of exhaustion, an overactive nervous system, or even reactivated trauma. Our guest encourages us to transform "Why bother?" from a stuck and cynical question into a productive inquiry that directs us towards what truly matters.

Jennifer Louden invites us to flip the script on “Why bother?” from cynical and stuck to a generative question to lead you toward what really matters to you.

Jennifer has been involved in the self-care movement for years. She authored the bestseller, The Woman’s Comfort Book in 1992 and has since written numerous books on well-being and creative living, including The Woman’s Retreat Book and Why Bother? She enjoys coaching writers and is currently working on a fantasy novel where older women use their power to buy humanity time from the climate crisis.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

Why the “why bother” stage is a normal part of life, and how it presents an opportunity to reset
How holding too tightly to an identity can keep us from seeing possibilities for change
How exiling and not claiming what we want leads to “why bother”
How taking action on the things that matter to us cultivates hope
How accepting that some things in life are not fixable can liberate us to step into new possibilities
How to begin cultivating a relationship with your desires

Learn more about Jennifer Louden:

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

EP 113: Curiosity as a Bridge: Uncovering Fears and Building Connections with Scott Shigeoka

How does curiosity show up in your life, work, and relationships?

Does your curiosity influence your strategy or planning? Or do you follow your curiosity to gain more knowledge or deepen your understanding of topics or viewpoints? Do you lean on curiosity to help you get to know someone better in ways that satisfy your interests or deepen your connection?

Do you keep following your curiosity even if it leads to uncomfortable or unknown places?

Our curiosity can reveal much about us, our interests, and our capacity for hope, discomfort, and imagination. But just as important is HOW we use our curiosity.

When we wield our curiosity to prove a point, we can cause division and harm. And when we use curiosity to honor others and our vulnerability, we can build the bridges necessary to cultivate the spaces we dream about and desire.

Today’s guest has combined his own lived experiences and research on curiosity and bridge-building into a powerful, nuanced book and set of practices on curiosity and how we use it in our relationships.

Scott Shigeoka believes curiosity has the power to transform your life and change the world. It's the key to connection, healing, and personal growth. It's a critical practice for your relationships, leadership, and life satisfaction. In his book, Seek: How Curiosity Can Transform Your Life and Change the World, Scott teaches readers to strengthen their curiosity muscles with his signature DIVE method.

Scott has appeared on The Today Show, Harvard Business Review, NPR, The Guardian, and CNBC, and he has spoken at Google, Microsoft, Pixar, IDEO, Meta, Airbnb, and universities and schools around the world and teaches at The University of Texas at Austin.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

How Scott’s cross-country road trip showed in real-time that approaching fears with curiosity builds connection, understanding, and possibility
The limits and boundaries to approaching others with curiosity in the moment
Why we need to bring curiosity and humility when we catch our own biases
How social and structural power dynamics influence how we balance curiosity, discomfort, and anger in a group
Three key questions to ask yourself to identify if your curiosity about another person or situation is invasive or predatory
How letting go of certainty opens up possibilities and allows for growth

Learn more about Scott Shigeoka:

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

EP 112: How Dreamwork Can Shape Better Leaders with Dee Kelley

What is your relationship with your dreams?

Not your goals or visions for the future, but the actual dreams that appear when you sleep?

Deepening our understanding of our dreams is not just a trailhead, but a transformative journey to better understanding ourselves, what drives us, what limits us, and what impacts our choices and behaviors.

Today’s guest, Selden “Dee” Kelley, urges us to take the time to reflect on dreams so that we can better understand how our inner systems are processing our present and our past. He reminds us of the profound power of witnessing our subconscious burdens, a process that validates our experiences and our desire to be seen and heard.

Dee is a lifelong learner. He holds five degrees in religion, psychology, an MBA, and a PhD in Industrial Psychology and Organizational Development. He served 18 years as the Pastor of the First Church of the Nazarene in San Diego and held various leadership and administration positions before becoming a pastor.

He has a deep passion for helping others discover the rich guidance that dream work can provide for their journey toward health and wholeness, and helps people connect with the power of their dreams as a pathway toward new insight, better decision-making, and improved creative thinking.

Content Note: Dee draws heavily from Jungian male-female archetypes. I want to note that the discussion of gender expands across the spectrum and is not limited to the male-female binary.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

How Dee’s approach blends hypotheses of the biological functions of dreaming and uses them in service of greater self-awareness
How every person’s dreams have an individual dialect
Advice for beginning to remember and take note of your dreams
Why specific interpretation can matter less than the reflections the interpretation leads to
How paying attention to our dreams can help us embrace imaginative, nuanced thinking
Differentiating between dream crushers and useful contrarian voices, in dreams and awake

Learn more about Dee Kelley:

Website
Instagram: @drdeedreamscoach

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

EP 111: Imagining New Possibilities of Inclusion with Meg Raby Klinghoffer

When you are excited about something, how do you show up?

Do you wear excitement and passion on your sleeve for all to see?

Maybe your personality is more low-key and strategic, and it is less obvious when you're really excited about an idea, a vision, or being a part of something.

Or maybe you adapt and edit yourself, muting your responses to play it cool for fear you won’t be taken seriously.

Yes, it’s essential to consider your role, environment, and audience when you feel energized about something. But if we’re constantly focused on who we should be, how we should act, and what the right thing to say is, it’s hard to have hope and a vision for the future.

Meg Raby Klinghoffer does not feel weighed down by messages about playing it cool and downplaying her excitement and joy anymore. She is emphatically all in with helping others envision how the spaces where we live, work, and play can be inclusive for those with invisible disabilities. She is becoming a contagion to create spaces where we can all be welcome and feel comfortable being ourselves, from concerts to museums to schools and beyond.

Meg is the author of the My Brother Otto series, a Speech-Language Pathologist, a writer for Scary Mommy, and a full-time employee of KultureCity, the nation’s leading nonprofit in sensory inclusion. She is also autistic.

At any given moment, Meg is thinking about how to better love the humans around her and how to create positive change without causing division.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

How receiving an autism diagnosis and owning that identity has allowed Meg to advocate for herself more freely
How to respectfully approach learning more about and supporting the autistic adults in your life
How having an autistic community helped Meg let go of old rules and embrace her identity
How KultureCity addresses the need for macro-level change to make spaces more supportive and inclusive
Meg’s vision for moving beyond awareness or acceptance to true inclusion

Learn more about Meg Raby Klinghoffer:

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

EP 110: Intro to Fall 2024 Series: The Generative Power of the Imagination

What sparks your imagination?

What shuts down your capacity to imagine?

Where does your mind go when the stakes are high, and the pressure feels too great? Do you find yourself mentally preparing for the worst possible outcomes, as if you were rehearsing a play? Do you shut down or numb out to manage your fears and anxieties?

Our brains naturally seek comfort in the known or fill in the unknown with potential disasters. However, it takes conscious effort and practice to build the capacity to imagine positive outcomes when things feel bleak.

But we can counter overwhelm and despair by connecting with imaginative individuals who embody hope, curiosity, and possibility grounded in vision and action.

These visionary leaders remind us that something different is possible and that we can choose to take deliberate action to change the prevailing tides.

In this new series of Unburdened Leader conversations, I’ll be in dialogue with leaders who urge us to envision a future that's not just a distant dream, but a reality we can actively shape today.

Over the next few months, you will hear conversations that invite you to take meaningful action here and now that does not deplete but heals and energizes.

These visionary conversations will help you connect with your desire to see a way through the noise and do something different.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

Why this moment feels so vital to share conversations with leaders imagining–and building–a more moral and just world
A taste of upcoming topics of conversation, from invisible disabilities to reframing resilience as a collective undertaking
Essential steps for building and protecting your capacity to hope and imagine in trying times

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

EP 109: Navigating Regrets and Embracing Inner Clarity with Molly Mahar

What does it mean to you to live a life with no regrets? Is that even possible?

What if it’s less about avoiding regrets entirely and more about being clear on your values, dreams, and desires and combining that with intentional practices to build a life focused on things that matter to you and the world around you?

Of course, this takes work because we’re constantly pulled in many different directions and responding to many inputs, just trying to keep our heads above water.

To lead well, we must get clarity in our values and develop trusting relationships with our inner worlds and physical bodies.

Instead of chasing a life with zero regrets, we need to learn to respond well to our regrets in the moment. If we want to look back and feel good about how we responded, we can’t numb out or bypass; we must make amends and correct our course.

Today’s conversation is with a long-time friend and colleague who reminds us that living an aligned life is a meandering path, a life that is always stretched and tested. It's not always easy, but when we stay connected to our values, desires, and integrity, there can be ease and clarity even in the hard times.

Molly Mahar is the founder of Stratejoy, a community helping women reclaim intimate, honest, and joyful relationships with themselves for the good of all. She's an entrepreneur, mama, writer, and adventurer obsessed with designing personal experiments that scare you, telling the truth, and her new teardrop trailer. In this episode, Molly shares her journey of living an aligned life, her struggles, and the lessons she learned along the way.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

How Molly prepared, financially and emotionally, to embark on a year of travel and a major move with her family
How relocating on their return may have actually made it easier for Molly to integrate her experiences
What putting their lives on hold and being together 24/7 revealed about Molly’s relationship with her husband, their parenting choices, and how they handle conflict
The support and practices that helped Molly get back in alignment
Unpacking her complicated relationship with alcohol and why she knew she needed to get sober for good
The core questions that Molly used to guide her self-reflection throughout the trip

Learn more about Molly Mahar:

Stratejoy
Instagram: @stratejoy, @mollymahar

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

EP 108: Speaking Truth to Power: Taking a Stand Guided by Faith and Love with Dee Kelley

What do you want to be known for? And what actions do you take to be seen in that light?

What lengths do you go to to avoid being misunderstood and viewed differently than what you want to be known for?

What drives what you want to be known for, and what are your choices to uphold your desired image or reputation?

Most of us have multiple internal agendas that shape our decisions and how we show up and are seen by others and ourselves. Our values, fears, and burdens, internally and externally, drive us.

When we place our worth and safety solely in the hands of others, we go to great lengths to hold on to how we want to be perceived. Lengths that too often leave a wake of chaos, abuse of power, manipulation, and betrayal–all to maintain the illusion of control.

We need more leaders who give us hope and reverence for humanity and others. These leaders do the work to build their capacity for discomfort so that they can lead with conviction, humility, and a deep sense of connectedness bigger than their personal ambitions or fears.

Joining us today is a guest who embodies the principles we discuss on this podcast. Dee Kelley is a leader who leads with love and compassion, demonstrating the power of these qualities in leadership. Our conversation with Dee is a reminder that compassion and empathy are not signs of weakness, but rather, tools for personal growth and resilience.

Selden “Dee” Kelley is a lifelong learner and a beacon of knowledge. With five degrees, his academic prowess is unmatched. He served 18 years as the Pastor of the First Church of the Nazarene in San Diego, demonstrating his deep understanding of faith and its intersection with personal development.

A driving force in his life is to help others discover the rich guidance that dream work can provide for their journey toward health and wholeness. He now helps people connect with the power of their dreams as a pathway toward new insight, better decision-making and improved creative thinking.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

Why Dee wanted to open a conversation about the relationship between the LGTBQIA+ community and the church, and why he has no regrets despite the consequences
How Dee came to realize that the things he feared in others were invitations for learning and growth
Why we need to commit to having hard conversations even when we don’t know the outcome
How a strong sense of values and identity apart from his position in the church softened the loss of his role and credentials
How Dee’s case sits in the larger context of faith communities grappling with and declaring how they will relate to LGBTQIA+ communities

Learn more about Dee Kelley:

Website
Instagram: @drdeedreamscoach

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

EP 107: The Seasons of Entrepreneurship: Leading a Deliberate Life with Laura Roeder

What are you deliberate about in your life?

What does living deliberately mean to you?

Would you say that you’re a deliberate person? Would those who know you say that you are deliberate in how you live your life and lead?

Living deliberately can be a real challenge, especially when we’re constantly dealing with unexpected issues and navigating through the many crises in our world. The pace of life is so fast, it often feels impossible to slow down and reflect before taking action.

But there’s something deeply important about being deliberate if we want to cultivate life, work, and relationships that align with our values. It is messy, awkward, and challenging, but it is so worth it.

Today’s guest has built a career that serves her personal needs, values, interests, and skills through deliberate action, even when it flies in the face of conventional wisdom about entrepreneurship.

Our guest today, Laura Roeder, is a true inspiration. She's a lifelong entrepreneur and the founder of several bootstrapped companies that have each reached multi-million dollar status. Her ventures include Paperbell, CoachCompare, MeetEdgar, Marie Forleo’s B-School, and LKR Social Media. She's been recognized as one of the top 100 entrepreneurs under 30 and has shared her insights on entrepreneurship at prestigious venues like the White House, the Virgin Unites Branson Centre of Entrepreneurship, the University of Southern California, and Loyola Marymount University.

Listen to the full episode to hear:

How Laura’s desire for time freedom has impacted her decision-making as a business owner
How launching a business immediately before having her first child fundamentally changed the way Laura has run every venture since
Why leaders need to let go of the belief that they can’t teach someone else to do what they do
How owning up to your mistakes and the steps you’ve taken to fix them builds trust
How Laura has navigated her desire to work and to lead after selling a company for a life-changing amount of money

Learn more about Laura Roeder:

Learn more about Rebecca:

Resources:

Bio of The Unburdened Leader

The Unburdened Leader podcast, hosted by Rebecca Ching, LMFT, is a show that focuses on the journey of leaders who have faced their own personal challenges, worked through them, and emerged as stronger and more impactful leaders. The podcast aims to provide insights, strategies, and inspiration to help leaders navigate their own struggles, prevent burnout, and lead with authenticity and effectiveness.

Each week, The Unburdened Leader features conversations with leaders who have overcome various obstacles and achieved personal and professional growth. These leaders share their experiences, lessons learned, and practical strategies for leading without being weighed down by stress, burnout, or isolation.

Rebecca Ching, a licensed therapist, and expert in leadership development, provides valuable guidance on redefining challenges, embracing vulnerability, and cultivating essential qualities such as courage, confidence, clarity, and compassion.

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