The Unburdened Leader

The Unburdened Leader podcast, hosted by Rebecca Ching, LMFT.

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Latest Episodes

EP 125: Power, Regulation, and Leadership: Connecting to Your Personal Power with Dr. Amanda Aguilera

EP 125: Power, Regulation, and Leadership: Connecting to Your Personal Power with Dr. Amanda Aguilera

In Twelve Step programs, the first step, as I understand it, is recognizing that we are powerless to heal alone.


We cannot overcome addiction, trauma, or systemic oppression through sheer willpower or individual effort. Healing, recovery, and meaningful change require connection, support, and systems that foster growth.


All true! But we should not make a virtue out of being powerless.


Recognizing what is beyond your ability isn’t the same as accepting that you are powerless to change. Powerlessness is, in fact, a protective response that disconnects us from our personal power.


When we conflate protection with powerlessness, we risk internalizing the very dynamics that keep us trapped in authoritarian systems—whether in families, partnerships, workplaces, faith communities, or governments.


Power-over systems create environments where speaking up feels dangerous, where challenging authority risks humiliation or exile. But no matter the system or oppression, we always retain what Right Use of Power methodology calls our personal power. And that’s precisely why authoritarian structures work so hard to make us feel otherwise.


Owning your personal power in an authoritarian system requires deep, intentional work. And we cannot do it alone.


My guest today will introduce you to the types of power in the Right Use of Power framework and help you reconnect with your personal power so that you can stand firm and do hard, scary, necessary things.


Dr. Amanda Aguilera currently serves as the Executive Director of the Right Use of Power Institute and a Trusted Advisor at The Ally Co. She has dedicated most of her career to helping people and organizations understand systems, conflict, and social power dynamics to create right relationship and a sense of belonging. She has a knack for making difficult conversations easier, complex ideas more accessible, and resistance more workable. Integrating power, contemplative practices, neurobiology, and restorative practices, she works by finding a balance of head and heart and facilitating the co-creation of strategic maps that lead us forward in a more equitable way.


Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • How the Right Use of Power framework gave Amanda language to understand and articulate power
  • Why power itself is fundamentally neutral
  • How Right Use of Power reframes power as a dynamic and not a possession
  • Breaking down the six types of power from personal to universal
  • Why direct challenges to status power are so often destabilizing 
  • How undeveloped personal power leads people to do harm with their role and status power
  • Why we have to become aware of how power exists in our relationships
  • How developing our personal power helps us to participate in the collective power that can actually challenge systems
  • How leaders can foster healthy power differential relationships


Learn more about Dr. Amanda Aguilera:


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

EP 124: Doing the Work: Internal Family Systems and Creativity with Sacha Mardou

EP 124: Doing the Work: Internal Family Systems and Creativity with Sacha Mardou

Toxic leadership stems from the burdens of unresolved trauma and difficult life experiences. 


When you don’t do the work to regulate your nervous system, the parts of you that protect you through mico-managing, shaming, blaming, not trusting anyone, or worse will eventually wreak havoc on your career, those you lead, and your own capacity for discomfort.


So, what does it look like for you to commit to doing the work?


Maybe you go to therapy or coaching, or adopt practices to deepen your self-awareness and reflection. The trouble is, “doing the work” can easily turn into navel-gazing or intellectualizing. The same tools that might help you unburden can also be used to numb out. We so often are sold the idea that we will overcome and be done with it that we bypass doing the real, deep, lifelong work.


Today’s guest illustrates–literally–what it looks and feels like to commit to doing powerful work. Her gorgeous new graphic novel, Past Tense, shares her windy and beautiful journey of doing the work through the lens of Internal Family Systems.


Sacha Mardou was born in Macclesfield in 1975 and grew up in Manchester, England. She began making comics after getting her BA in English Literature from the University of Wales, Lampeter. Her critically acclaimed graphic novel series, Sky in Stereo, was named an outstanding comic of 2015 by the Village Voice and shortlisted for the 2016 Slate Studio Prize.


Since 2019 she has been making comics about therapy and healing. Her graphic memoir Past Tense: Facing Family Secrets and Finding Myself in Therapy is out now. Since 2005 she has lived in St Louis, Missouri with her cartoonist husband Ted May, their daughter and two disruptive cats.


Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • How going to therapy for what she thought was just anxiety became a journey of unpacking her past 
  • How her therapist helped her “correct the picture” she’d been holding of people and events of her childhood
  • How Sacha adapted her private sketched therapy notes into the comics she shares publicly
  • How working with IFS to process her childhood has impacted her present-day relationships
  • How the IFS process has helped Sacha recast her difficult experiences as gifts and strengths and her story as valuable
  • How Sacha approached writing her book wholeheartedly, while still protecting her boundaries


Learn more about Sacha Mardou:


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

EP 123: Befriending Your Nervous System: Building Capacity for Regulation with Deb Dana

EP 123: Befriending Your Nervous System: Building Capacity for Regulation with Deb Dana

These days, the call for leaders to be adaptable, agile, flexible, clear, focused, and calm could lead many to think it's not okay to feel or that you need to be a robot.


We minimize our feelings and put on a brave face until we can no longer fake it, sometimes in the name of being “regulated.”


When there's a trend in language or an approach to healing, it can sometimes be reductive in how it's taught, explained, or understood. Concepts drawn from Polyvagal Theory, like regulation and activation, are no exception.


How some talk about regulation and dysregulation can create pressure to diminish our humanity so that we don't emote, and cause us to criticize someone if they're upset.


In reality, Polyvagal Theory offers a powerful addition to your toolbox for leading yourself and others well while staying aligned with your values. 


When we work towards helping our nervous systems become more agile and adaptable by putting in the reps and working to understand our systems and our stories, we can offer those we love and lead a greater sense of curiosity, compassion, and connection. And we will have enough boundaries and guardrails to know when to tap out, take a break, and ask for help.


Today’s guest teaches and discusses these topics so that we can learn to regulate our nervous systems better and connect better with others. 


Deb Dana, LCSW, is a clinician, consultant, author, and international lecturer on polyvagal theory-informed work with trauma survivors and is the leading translator of this scientific work to the public and mental health professionals. She's a founding member of the Polyvagal Institute and creator of the signature Rhythm of Regulation® clinical training series.

Deb's work shows us how understanding polyvagal theory applies across the board to relationships, mental health, and trauma. She delves into the intricacies of how we can all use and understand the organizing principles of polyvagal theory to change the ways we navigate our daily lives. 

Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • Why regulation is not a static state but an ongoing dynamic experience 
  • How understanding the subconscious survival responses of the nervous system under stress can help us learn to regulate and repair
  • Why we can’t discount or dismiss the messages our survival responses are trying to give us
  • How even micro-moments of responding to our nervous systems’ needs can create change
  • How building capacity to resourcing regulation increases our capacity to sit with discomfort and struggle in our lives and in the world
  • How leaders can use Polyvagal Theory concepts to create connected, collaborative environments for themselves and those they lead


Learn more about Deb Dana:


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

EP 122: 2024 Debrief: Rhythms, Reps, and Metabolizing Loss

EP 122: 2024 Debrief: Rhythms, Reps, and Metabolizing Loss

I know I’m not alone in feeling like 2024 was a year. So many of us are still working through everything that happened as we wonder exactly what lies ahead.


As part of that reflection on the year past and preparing for the year ahead, long-time listeners may know that I am a big believer in debriefing. I debrief weekly, monthly, quarterly, and annually, and each year, I share my annual debrief with you.


This debrief includes personal reflections about events in my life, how my words of the year brought some interesting data to light and guided my actions, and themes about what’s working and what’s not working as we begin the new year. 


Content note: Discussion of death by suicide


Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • How my words of the year–rhythm and reps–challenged some of my deeply engrained habits and unrealistic expectations
  • How a series of events in my personal life led to shifts in my rhythms and reps and deeper healing
  • What 35 tomato plants taught me about priorities and planning
  • Wisdom that stuck with me from live talks by Elizabeth Gilbert and Anne Lamott
  • Experiences that brought me joy last year and why joy is essential to doing the hard work ahead
  • Managing anger and outrage in our political climate through curiosity and healing, unburdened leadership


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

EP 121: Loving the Other Side: Leadership That Bridges Divides with Frank Anderson

EP 121: Loving the Other Side: Leadership That Bridges Divides with Frank Anderson

As I’ve been reflecting on the past year, themes of relational trauma, betrayal trauma, and shame have come up again and again in our culture at large and in the work I do with leaders.


Relational and betrayal traumas disrupt our ability to trust—ourselves, others, and even the world around us. These wounds often linger in ways we don’t fully see. They impact how we navigate relationships, handle conflict, and lead ourselves and others.


And far, far too often, these unaddressed, unhealed traumas beget shame. Shame is one of the most destructive forces in leadership and relationships.


When leaders operate out of shame, it’s volatile and dangerous. It hurts both those who wield it and those who experience it. Healing shame requires sharing our pain with those who have earned the right to hear our stories—those who can hold space for us with compassion, accountability, and empathy.


Empathy is the antidote to shame, and it’s also what transforms leadership. Leaders who can navigate challenges with compassion, even under immense pressure, create trust, relational resilience, and growth environments.


In today’s replay of my conversation with Dr. Frank Anderson, he reminds us that healing isn’t just personal—it’s deeply relational. He also offers the provocative idea that we all have the capacity to be healers and the capacity to harm.


When we commit to healing, we reclaim our ability to lead with clarity, compassion, and courage.

Frank Anderson, MD, completed his residency and was a clinical instructor in psychiatry at Harvard Medical School. He is an author, psychiatrist, therapist, speaker, and trauma specialist who’s spent the past three decades studying neuroscience and trauma treatment. He is passionate about teaching brain-based psychotherapy and integrating current neuroscience knowledge with the IFS therapy model. His published work spans contributions to literature and training for a clinical audience and works accessible to the general public.


Content Warning: We cover some heavy topics around verbal and physical abuse, conversion therapy, and suicidal ideation. Please take care as you listen to this conversation.


Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • Why it was so important for Frank to tell his story from a place of healing and love, even for the people who hurt him the most
  • How releasing fear, anger, and shame makes space for forgiveness, healing, and love
  • Why forgiveness and relational healing can only come after processing and releasing the trauma of what happened within yourself
  • Why Frank says that healing is possible, but we’re never done healing
  • How holding onto divisive binary thinking harms all of us and keeps our culture from healing
  • How holding space with love and empathy can help people acknowledge what happened and accept accountability
  • How unprocessed trauma causes us to repeat toxic patterns in our lives


Learn more about Frank Anderson, MD:


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

EP 120: Permission to Pause: How Glimmers Fuel Creativity and Leadership with Amanda Jones

EP 120: Permission to Pause: How Glimmers Fuel Creativity and Leadership with Amanda Jones

When was the last time you felt truly moved by something you saw or heard?


It could be a piece of art or music, a line from a book or poem, being with someone you love, or even a perfect bite of food, but those moments that stop us in our tracks are more than fleeting pleasures.


These “glimmers” create space for our bodies to exhale so that we can experience wonder, awe, and joy.


Learning to recognize and lean into these moments isn’t just about respite from the hard things; they help us navigate challenging times by reminding us that humans need connection, creativity, and hope. 


Today’s guest is a multi-disciplinary artist whose work invites us into a world of creativity and intention. It is a testament to the necessity of nurturing creativity and wonder, and what’s possible when we follow their pull as allies in our journey to love and lead with boldness and integrity.


Amanda Jones is an artist, poet, and filmmaker living and working in the northern beaches of Sydney Australia. Amanda studied ‘Contemporary dance and choreography’ at the School of Creative Arts and ‘Styling and creative direction’ at Whitehouse Fashion Institute. She founded her film production company One Minute Film in 2015 working with clients such as The Iconic, Nimble Activewear, and Barre Body. In 2021 Amanda published her first book Diary of a Freelancer, its success shifted her work into her full-time art practice. 


Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • How early experiences at the intersection of creativity and commerce shaped Amanda’s career trajectory
  • How Amanda realized that some pieces of her journals were meant to be shared
  • Why her journaling practice is vital to both her personal life and her work life
  • How Amanda approached self-publishing her book to make it a piece of art and embrace its mistakes
  • How balancing play and discipline as she takes on a new medium helps Amanda combat imposter syndrome
  • How Amanda protects her creativity and imagination despite our challenging world


Learn more about Amanda Jones:


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

EP 119: Choosing Health Over Hustle: A Radical Reimagining of Success and Survival with Kirsten Powers

EP 119: Choosing Health Over Hustle: A Radical Reimagining of Success and Survival with Kirsten Powers

Have you ever looked around and felt that the way you live and work isn’t sustainable? 


It’s hard to find anyone who hasn’t felt the weight of this relentless pace and the intense pressure to keep up as if this is just how modern life has to be.


But what if it doesn’t have to be this way? 


Our culture in the U.S. is burdened by pressures to keep up, excel, and do it all, often without the support systems to help us carry that load.


What if we paused to question the assumptions driving us to stay so busy and overextended? 


Today’s guest invites us to imagine stepping off the hamster wheel and envisioning what it would look like to challenge the norms we’ve been handed about work and life.


We can’t all pack up and move, but we can make small but powerful steps towards a more sustainable way of living, working, and leading.


Kirsten Powers is a New York Times bestselling author and writes the bestselling Substack publication Changing the Channel. Jon Meacham called her most recent book, Saving Grace: Speak Your Truth, Stay Centered and Learn to Coexist with People Who Drive You Nuts, "a great gift at an urgent hour.” 


Kirsten served as an on-air CNN senior political analyst for seven years. She has been a columnist for USA Today, the Daily Beast and the New York Post, and a political analyst at Fox News. Before her career in journalism, Kirsten was a political appointee in the Clinton Administration, worked in New York Democratic politics and was Vice President for International Communications at AOL, Inc.


Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • Kirsten’s awakening to the fact that American culture is “not normal”
  • How neoliberalism reshaped our relationship with work, class, and consumerism
  • A reality check on what it takes to make radical changes in your life, at home or abroad
  • How unpacking paradigms about work and being busy has led Kirsten to question so many other norms in American life
  • The intense and long-term physical toll of our culture’s obsession with overwork
  • What gives Kirsten hope that America can do and be better in the future 


Learn more about Kirsten Powers:


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

EP 118: Leading Through Uncertainty: The Power of Compassionate Presence

EP 118: Leading Through Uncertainty: The Power of Compassionate Presence

Humans tend to crave certainty. In the face of the unknown, we rely on prescriptions and narratives to help us feel better and make sense of what we can’t yet see coming.


For many, sitting with uncertainty like what we are facing now, post-election in the United States, is deeply unsettling and even destabilizing. They brace for what might come next, anxious and ruminating, and looking for answers. 


It’s a natural human response, but it can also leave us stuck in a loop that offers no comfort, only more fear and anxiety.


People will look to the leaders around them for comfort and for answers. And while you may not be able to provide the definitive answers anyone seeks, you can help those you lead and love feel supported and grounded as we all navigate these difficult times.


Today, I’m sharing strategies, practices, and thoughts that can help us move through uncertainty, for ourselves and the ones we love and lead.


Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • How and why to establish “certainty anchors” for those you lead
  • Why an honest, compassionate presence is more beneficial than pretending you have all the answers
  • Why we need to balance courage and comfort, and the fine line between caring and caretaking
  • Why finding grounding routines is essential, no matter how small or scrappy or imperfect
  • How claiming your personal power and agency will help you feel less stuck
  • How we build trust and resilience in our relationships amidst uncertainty


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

EP 117: Rethinking Resilience: Moving from Bouncing Back to Relational Resilience with Soraya Chemaly

EP 117: Rethinking Resilience: Moving from Bouncing Back to Relational Resilience with Soraya Chemaly

When you think about resilience, what comes to mind?


Our culture loves narratives about triumphing over hardship. And overcoming pain, heartbreak, and even abuse can make us stronger.


However, uplifting “overcoming” too often comes at the expense of actually examining and addressing the lack of care, protection, and support people had to navigate on their path to resilience. We valorize grit and perseverance at the cost of people’s health and wellbeing, encouraging them to just keep pushing past the point of burnout.


My guest today pulls back the curtain on these narratives of overcoming adversity and building resilience to find that so much of the adversity people face is rooted in how we fail to care for ourselves and each other in our society. Real resilience, she says, isn’t about your own personal toughness; it’s about how we relate to and support each other.


Soraya Chemaly is an award-winning author and activist. She writes and speaks frequently on topics related to gender norms, inclusivity, social justice, free speech, sexualized violence, and technology. She is the author of The Resilience Myth: New Thinking on Grit, Strength, and Growth after Trauma and Rage Becomes Her: The Power of Women’s Anger, which was recognized as a Best Book of 2018 by the Washington Post, Fast Company, Psychology Today, and NPR. She has contributed to several anthologies, most recently Free Speech in the Digital Age and Believe Me: How Trusting Women Can Change The World. Soraya is also a co-producer of a WMC #NameItChangeIt PSA highlighting the effects of online harassment on women in politics in America.


Listen to the full episode to hear:

  • How Soraya made the connection between our toxic ideology of resilience and how we devalue community support and care
  • How the idea of “bouncing back” can actually impede change, both personal and social
  • How resilience narratives flatten, decontextualize, and depoliticize trauma and recovery 
  • Why we need to shift our concept of resilience from individual to communal, cultural, and relational
  • How “soldiering on” can perpetuate a lack of options within the system
  • The false binaries we have to confront to dismantle the resilience of the status quo
  • How telling someone they are or need to be resilient shuts down opportunities for real care and support


Learn more about Soraya Chemaly:


Learn more about Rebecca:


Resources:

Bio of The Unburdened Leader

The Unburdened Leader podcast, hosted by Rebecca Ching, LMFT, is a show that focuses on the journey of leaders who have faced their own personal challenges, worked through them, and emerged as stronger and more impactful leaders. The podcast aims to provide insights, strategies, and inspiration to help leaders navigate their own struggles, prevent burnout, and lead with authenticity and effectiveness.

Each week, The Unburdened Leader features conversations with leaders who have overcome various obstacles and achieved personal and professional growth. These leaders share their experiences, lessons learned, and practical strategies for leading without being weighed down by stress, burnout, or isolation.

Rebecca Ching, a licensed therapist, and expert in leadership development, provides valuable guidance on redefining challenges, embracing vulnerability, and cultivating essential qualities such as courage, confidence, clarity, and compassion.

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